Mordor: Suicide without Sauron?

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Ygdrazill 06/Nov/2006 at 01:18 PM
Thief of Mordor Points: 315 Posts: 63 Joined: 09/Sep/2006

An idea just struck me the other day. How did sauron rule his country at the end of the third age with Mordor as "basecamp". Perhaps im just affected by the movies but I do remember Mordor from the books as the desert, "hard to even find water" country with way, way, way lots of orcs running around preparing for war like if there were no tomorrow. Even orcs do eat dont they? I can imagine there must have been some sort of cannabalism, but no way in that quantity that all of Mordor could make a living from it. Then ofcourse, he must have had hunters out hunting for food but the thought of that feeding an army is just absurb.

Did Sauron influent on this perhaps? He was after all a maia, and a powerful one to. If you have any thoughts or better up: the genuine explanation i have missed, just post my dear friends. Wright untill your fingers bleed. Il be waiting.

Endril 06/Nov/2006 at 01:35 PM
Healer of Imladris Points: 9193 Posts: 9362 Joined: 15/Jan/2006
Ygdrazill: Welcome to the Plaza and forums. See, elves can be welcoming to minnions too. Just kidding.

Indeed orcs needed to fead and dring. Remember they had certain drinks that they used for long travels, like the ones they gave to Merry and Pippin. Also it was water in the mountains in Mordor. Frodo didn’t drinked it because it was infested but orcs had no problem with that. Frodo only drank once that water.

Orcs sometimes were canibals but not the way that they would self distruct. Probably food was gave to them and remember that they kille people sometimes so where would that meat go? Also thay killed a lot of animals in there journeys and they had on what to feed. I even remember that the soldiers of Mordor had bread too.
Carandol Eredion 06/Nov/2006 at 01:49 PM
Healer of Minas Tirith Points: 7773 Posts: 4040 Joined: 13/Aug/2006
While Mordor was not a particularly productive place, the areas along the route of Frodo and Sam seem to have been the most desert-like. However, the whole of Mordor was not a desert, there was some agriculuture practised in the south, and Mordor also had many allies elsewhere in more productive regions. In fact, it seems to have been a fairly efficient economy:

’Neither he nor Frodo knew of the great slave-worked fields away south in this wide realm, beyond the fumes of the Mountain by the dark sad waters of Lake Núrnen; nor of the great roads that ran away east and south to tributary lands, from which the soldiers of the Tower brought long waggon-trains of goods and booty and fresh slaves. Here in the northward regions were the mines and forges, and the musterings of long-planned war; and here the Dark Power, moving its armies like pieces on the board, brought them together.’ RotK, The Land of Shadow
Sil 07/Nov/2006 at 02:31 AM
New Soul Points: 25641 Posts: 21386 Joined: 22/Sep/2004
Also Orcs are fairly hardy creatures, adapted to such a barren wasteland. If you’re taking in liquids, you don’t necessarily need to drink water regularly (and certainly I imagine they would drink blood, if nothing else), and of course, one doesn’t imagine them needing water for bathing. *g* The liquor they marinated would possibly need plants, but there’s always the Thorn of Mordor I suppose, or if you’re really desperate, anything that used to be living tissue will ferment.

And yes, Carandol has a very good quote there too..
Alcarináro 07/Nov/2006 at 03:07 AM
Banned Points: 14162 Posts: 14178 Joined: 24/Sep/2003
The Donner Party was forced to eat each other, for lack of food. Via that, should we say that the human race is cannibalistic? No, Legolas Fireblade, we should not. Likewise, to claim that Orcs were cannibals is misguided. Contrary to popular thought, Orcs do not eat each other (except, like in the example I brought up before, under extreme circumstances). One should note that while there are several instances of Orcs having squabbles and killing each other in LotR, there is not one single account of the victor eating the fallen, despite what the Great Liar Peter Jackson would have you believe. To quote the relevant passage:
For one thing Morgoth had achieved was to convince the Orcs beyond refutation that the Elves were crueller than themselves, taking captives only for ’amusement’, or to eat them (as the Orcs would do at need).
   -HoME X: Morgoth’s Ring, Myths Transformed, Text X

That is, Orcs would eat their captives if there was no other source of food available. One would think that if there were no captives and no food, they might turn to cannibalism. Like the Donner Party.
Ygdrazill 07/Nov/2006 at 04:00 AM
Thief of Mordor Points: 315 Posts: 63 Joined: 09/Sep/2006

Legolas yeah they did have water il admit that, and sure they would have some imagination and have some speciell "orc made" food to, like lembas.

Elenhir Really good point, it never stops to amaze me how much crusiall facts there are hidden in the book, thank you.

Carandol: Didint know about the fields in Mordor, but it sure makes sense that he would practise agriculture to. And I agree with the part about the allies providing him. He was a powerful lord, he would sure be able to get what he wanted. 

Purrsephone Good point about orc being adapted to thiere enviorment, they have allmost allways (perhaps after the fall of Morgoth) been supressed and been forced to live on allmost nothing, makes sense they would evolve to some more hardier race.

Endril 07/Nov/2006 at 08:27 AM
Healer of Imladris Points: 9193 Posts: 9362 Joined: 15/Jan/2006
Ygdrazill: I don’t think orcs would eat the elven lembas. They hated all that was elven, like all the dark creatures. Even Gollum hated the elven bread. The bred of the orcs was just bread, no special thing about it like in the case of lembas. I think thay just ate what they killed mostly.
Mithrandír 07/Nov/2006 at 08:40 AM
Linguist of Lothlorien Points: 3280 Posts: 3291 Joined: 13/Mar/2006
Also it was water in the mountains in Mordor. Frodo didn’t drinked it because it was infested but orcs had no problem with that. Frodo only drank once that water.
oh really? i did not know that their was some kind of water in the the great, firey mountains of Mordor. Are you sure? if you could confirm please...
Ygdrazill 07/Nov/2006 at 09:07 AM
Thief of Mordor Points: 315 Posts: 63 Joined: 09/Sep/2006
Legolas i only meant that they surely had some food, or drinks like in this case, that were typical or even unique for thiere cind. And I just took as example the elven bread Lembas and compared it to perhaps the orc drink you talked about. I see now my sentance could me missunderstood
geordie 07/Nov/2006 at 09:54 AM
Hugo Bracegirdle Points: 20570 Posts: 14087 Joined: 06/Mar/2005
There is water in Mordor - apart from the streams falling in from the mountains, the orcs had hard roads in the north, along which they placed water cisterns to catch the rainwater. See The Land of Shadow.

Durin of Moria 20/Nov/2006 at 06:29 PM
Scribe of Erebor Points: 467 Posts: 260 Joined: 24/Mar/2006
There is water in Nurn, in the sea of Nurnen, south of Mordor, and the soil around this sea is fertile, and is where most of Sauron’s Slave farms are.