The East

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Jesus Freak 23/Nov/2006 at 09:40 AM
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I notice that the east is mentioned sometimes, like in the Silmarillion when it mentions where the Quendi came from. But the east is never actually mapped, is it? I’ve always been curious about it when I first saw the map of Middle Earth. The land continues in that direction, but the map stops. Is the East mapped anywhere in any book?

Qtpie 23/Nov/2006 at 09:47 AM
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I don’t think there are any maps of the East, at least not that I know of.
Battlehamster 23/Nov/2006 at 01:57 PM
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I kind of like not having the east all mapped out.  Leaves more for the imagination.  Although I would like to know about the Blue Wizards.
Oin 23/Nov/2006 at 08:18 PM
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The only maps containing information about the East can be found in the older HoME volumes, particularly IV and V. However, these deal with older conceptions of Middle-Earth and don’t apply to the LotR-era conceptions of the continent.

Battlehamster: If you want more info about the Blue Wizards, information about them can be found in Unfinished Tales: The Istari or HoME XII: Last Writings. For information on the Plaza about them, there are some excellent threads about them by halfir called "Somethings New about Somethings Blue" or something like that. You can probably find them by searching in the archives.
Durin of Moria 24/Nov/2006 at 06:24 AM
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Maybe some other websites have these maps, but I am not sure if they are reliable. Not from Tolkien, I think.
Skauril 24/Nov/2006 at 08:53 AM
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Yeah, there are plenty of maps around the web that detail the areas beyond the boundries of the northwestern corner or Middle-earth. Sadly, most of them (almost all of them, actually) are completely unreliable, being either fan made, or based on Iron Crown Enterprise’s conception of Middle-earth (made for role playing purposes).

Here’s one of I.C.Es maps. It looks professionally made and reliable, but unfortunately it’s about as far from Tolkien’s own vision as Peter Jackson’s movies were from the books (not to slander the movies too much.. they were great in their own right, and brought Tolkien’s world to life, but still, a little too much artistic freedom was utilized in their making).

http://www.taivaansusi.net/roolipelit/lindefirion/political_map.jpg

Jesus Freak 26/Nov/2006 at 05:29 AM
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Actually I have also made a map just for fun, but only on paper. I just wish I could see some of the places mentioned. I agree, Skauril. I also wish Peter Jackson had stuck to the books better, especially when he skipped the Scouring of the Shire. That was a major dissapointment. One more question, where is the East described best? For example, what chapter of what book?  Thanks for the answers everybody!
Skauril 26/Nov/2006 at 06:05 AM
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Jesus Freak, I will never put anyone down for sating their curiosity by coming up with their own ideas of what the unknown regions of Middle-earth look like. If you have the imagination to come up with something, good for you.  

I only have beef with people trying to sell ’their’ Middle-earth as something that Tolkien would approve. I’m sure Tolkien had his own concept of what the east and south looked like, and I’m pretty sure no one can match his vision close enough to be able to claim to have hit the mark.

The I.C.E map annoys the hell out of me for another reason, also..  there are places in the bay of Forochel (extreme northwest) that are named in my native tongue, Finnish!! ’Järvamaa’ is one letter away from ’Järvimaa’, which means Lakeland in my tongue. And one of the towns or settlements I.C.E drew on the map in that area is named ’Pitkäranta’, which is in fact a real place in Finland (there are a couple of places with that name, actually). ’Pitkäranta’ translates directly to ’Longshore’.

That’s cheesy. It would be the same if I went and made a map of Middle-earth and randomly placed towns such as Jacksonville, Seattle or friggin’ Moscow on it.   "Come, my fellow travelers. The road from Pitkäranta to the capital of Rhun, Moscow, is fraught with peril. It is a long and dangerous path, but thank heavens we can stop and rest for a spell on the way in the city of Frankfurt in Rhovanion. Perhaps.. Eru willing.. we will travel all the way to the utmost east, to the dwarven fortress of Beijing."

 

Jesus Freak 27/Nov/2006 at 10:25 AM
Apprentice of Minas Tirith Points: 188 Posts: 49 Joined: 16/Nov/2006
 Yeah, it does sound kind of crazy. I do want to make the map I’m making accurate, though. Anybody know where the East is described the best? For example, what chapter of what book? Or what part of a chapter? Anyone? Again, thanks for the answers!
Shadeofdeath 27/Nov/2006 at 05:20 PM
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I wish there were, it would be cool.
Skauril 28/Nov/2006 at 03:27 AM
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Jesusfreak, I highly recommend you get a copy of ’The Atlas of Middle Earth’ by Karen Wynn Fonstad. It has several large maps that detail the entire world of Arda; maps that are based on Tolkien’s own sketches (as in copied more or less directly from them with regards to the shape of the continents etc).

That should give you a good idea of what kind of shape to draw for the landmasses, if you wish to stay true to Tolkien’s vision. Beyond that.. just draw a big mountain chain somewhere far to the east (the Red Mountains, also known as the Orocarni) that stretches in a north-south direction, and another somewhat smaller mountain range in the southeast (the Yellow Mountains). The large, open plain between the northwest of Middle-earth and the Orocarni was known as Palisor, at least in the first age (if you want to draw names or details other than ’Rhun’ in the eastern plains). Orome went there to hunt and roam with the beasts. Also, Sauron had an abode somewhere in the unknown regions of the east (as you probably read in another thread I started) during the third age, described as being ’surrounded by fire’. You could always use your imagination and come up with a precise location and a name for it (you might want to use the black speech to name it in accordance with Tolkien’s linguistic standards).

Anyway, just a few ideas I highly recommend incorporating into the map. Also, are you planning on mapping the east, or the south as well? And is there any chance you could scan the map and post it here once it’s finished?

I wish I could give you a specific page number from the books in which the East is discussed in detail, but unfortunately, the information is very much spread out, and most of what little is known is derived from Tolkien’s notes and letters (the trilogy itself features very little information on the topic of the East) which appeared in the Silmarillion, The Unfinished Tales etc. Maybe someone else can be of more help with this.

Jesus Freak 28/Nov/2006 at 10:51 AM
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Ok, thanks! I’ll try to post it when it’s done, but it won’t be done for a loooong time. And it probably won’t look all that great, but hey, it’s fun.  I actually have seen that book in the fanatic’s shop, but it says it’s out of stock!    Oh well. Thanks again for the input!
Deagol77 28/Nov/2006 at 11:29 AM
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How about a competition? Who ever makes the best map of the east wins fame as a map maker on the plaza. It would be interesting to see all of the different ideas people have about what is in the east.

Jesus Freak 29/Nov/2006 at 07:36 AM
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Cool! What are the rules? Is there a deadline? I would want a long time to finish mine. Sounds like a lot of fun, though!  By the way, Skauril, did you know you’re supposed to visit the promotion center to advance to the next rank?
Deagol77 29/Nov/2006 at 08:58 PM
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How about the deadline could be by New Years day. The rules are that it must go south far enough to show the pass from Khand into Mordor, north far enough to the Lonely mountains, as far west as you want, and as far east as your imagination and Tolkien knowledge will take you. I would suggest either scanning the map, or taking a digital picture of it and saving it on to the computer. Who should judge though?
Skauril 30/Nov/2006 at 12:48 AM
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Jesus Freak, nope, I wasn’t aware of any ranking system.  I suppose it’s time for me to advance then, huh?

If you guys get a map competition going, keep me posted on the details! Sounds like an interesting idea.   Nothing like a little healthy competition to push oneself to new creative heights!

Jesus Freak 30/Nov/2006 at 06:36 AM
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Are you going to do it Deagol77? It does sound fun! Mine probably won’t go too far south. I like the East so much better! Yes, Skauril, I would recommend advancing. Also, if you visit the Finance center every twenty-four hours, you could pick up your daily salary and get some more fanatic credits!

Deagol77 30/Nov/2006 at 11:09 AM
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Yeah, I’m going to do one. I think I will use the Anduin as a western border. We should not only name Sauron’s presumed eastern fortress, but the three dwarf kingdoms that may be in the Red abd Yellow Mountains. We could also add Easterling fortresses and cities. The plaza is probably the best place to get information on where stuff is in the east

And Skauril I would suggest joining the dwarves, we are awesome!

Skauril 30/Nov/2006 at 01:31 PM
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Man, I’ve missed out on this advancement and rank system altogether. And I’ve been here for two years (only logging on very sporadically, though.. I think I went close to a year without visiting here at all). 

This map thing has gotten me all excited. I used to have an extensive map collection back when I was a kid. They detailed a fantasy world I created for a pen and paper RPG I created. If only my imagination were still as vivid as it was back then...

I don’t have a scanner, but a friend of mine does, so I could draw a map and scan it on his computer. We’ll see....

Deagol, the name ’Skauril’ is supposed to be an easterling name, so I’m not sure how well I’d fit in with you bearded stunties.  But if there’s no specific easterling faction, I might join you.

Deagol77 30/Nov/2006 at 09:05 PM
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All right, we have three contestants. Maybe we should start a thread where people could give their own judging on which map is best.
Jesus Freak 01/Dec/2006 at 08:11 AM
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Alright! So we turn our maps in on New Years Day or before, right? We post them in this thread, right? I think accuracy, creativity, and realism should be the main factors of judging. What do you guys think? And lastly, should we ask an administrator to be the main judge for the final decision? Let the mapping begin!   (We can begin at any time, right?)

Shame on you Skauril! Mordor is EVIL!!!

Skauril 01/Dec/2006 at 08:37 AM
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Maybe I’ll change my allegiance at some point if I get tired of being treated like a lowly dog under Sauron’s command.

So it shall be. The maps shall be posted within this thread, and if the thread has been buried in the archives by the time the maps are finished, a new thread shall be made. We could always ask an administrator to be the main judge, if one of them is willing. Comments and criticism from the regular members would also be welcome.

A friend of mine borrowed my copy of The Atlas of Middle Earth a long time ago. I hope he still has it, because I can’t really make a map without using it as a point of reference.

Get started whenever you are ready! Good luck, and godspeed!  

Jesus Freak 01/Dec/2006 at 02:25 PM
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Um, didn’t we have more posts in this forum? Or did an administrator delete some? If so, why? And you do have to contain the East in your map! I’m going to have the very eastern border of Tolkein’s map of ME be my western border. After all, this is a map of the East!

Good luck guys!

Deagol77 01/Dec/2006 at 03:16 PM
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Yeah there were some more. I remember a lot more people besides us posting here. Yeah, my old Atlas of Middle Earth was eaten by my neice. And then I spilled coffee all over it. It may be a while before I can get a new one so, my map will take a little while longer.
Deagol77 01/Dec/2006 at 05:19 PM
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Oh yeah! Jesus Freak, amazon.com has like 50 copies of Atlas of Middle Earth. I just recently ordered one. This way, we will all have equal resources for making our maps! They just archived the forums, so there are far fewer threads and posts. I think they do it monthly.
Jesus Freak 02/Dec/2006 at 07:05 AM
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Ok, cool! And I might not get the Atlas of Middle Earth, but it doesn’t matter too much. I’ll probably get it for Christmas or something. Thanks anyway!
Lifur 02/Dec/2006 at 01:32 PM
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Just joined, and looking through this thread, Deagol77 is refferring to three dwarf fortresses in the East.  We have Moria, Belegost and Nogrod inthe West, so three plus three equals six.  Am i wrong in thinking that the petty dwarves are not one of the seven houses, or is the seventh located elsewhere again?
Deagol77 02/Dec/2006 at 06:01 PM
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Oh yeah, there are only three in the west. There are four in the east.
Deagol77 02/Dec/2006 at 09:46 PM
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Hey Skauril, what was the other name for the Red Mountains? And what was the name for the plain between the west and east? I just don’t want to go rooting through the archives.
Skauril 03/Dec/2006 at 12:35 AM
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Deagol, the red mountains were known as the Orocarni. I don’t know if there was a specific name for the yellow mountains (I’m guessing Tolkien never gave us one, since that particular mountain chain seems to have been of little consequence in the events of the ages).

The large, open plain between the Orocarni and the northwest was known as Palisor, a place where Orome came to hunt in the first age. However, the world changed after the War of Wrath and the sinking of Beleriand, so it is not certain whether that name still applies to that region. Personally I consider it appropriate enough. After all, we know that the Orocarni survived intact through the ages, and their name didn’t change, so we might as well use the name Palisor to describe the central areas of Middle-earth in the third age and beyond, based on the fact that they carried that name in the first age. 

There are surely other lands in the East as well, perhaps beyond the Orocarni, or far to the north or southeast.

Also, one more thing I forgot to mention is that there were elves dwelling in the East along with the four remaining dwarves and easterlings (though men doubtlessly outnumbered the dwarves and elves, just as they do in the West). They were known as the Avari, and also as the East Elves or the Unwilling. The latter title derived from their unwillingless to join their brethren on the journey to the west when they first awoke as a race near the slopes of the Orocarni. They still dwelled somewhere in the East in the third age, and most likely some time into the fourth age as well. Furthermore, it has been speculated that the mysterious realm of Dorwinion on the northwestern shores of the Sea of Rhun might in fact be an Avari realm; doubtlessly the westernmost of their realms in Middle-earth if this is indeed the case. However, it is still open to debate, and it might also be a kingdom of men for all we know.

 

Jesus Freak 03/Dec/2006 at 06:25 AM
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Cuivienen, Water of Awakening, still exists, right? The Silmarillion says In the changes of the world the shapes of lands and of seas have been broken and remade; rivers have not kept their courses, neither have mountains remained steadfast; and to Cuivienen there is no returning. Does this mean its gone?
Skauril 03/Dec/2006 at 01:29 PM
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That I cannot answer with any certainty. Judging from the quote you posted, I’d say that Cuivienen either became impossible/very difficult to access because of the changed shape of the lands, or wiped off the map completely along with the Sea of Helkar. The mountains in the east were, however, still standing in the third and fourth ages, but their shape was altered (as they were no longer connected to the Ered Engrin, the Iron Mountains, that ran across northern ME in the first age).

Lifur 03/Dec/2006 at 05:31 PM
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I always took the ’there is no returning’ passage to be more along the lines of the fact that the choices made by the elves that day cannot be unmade: the willing passed west, and all their fates were written by this, and the avari remained, and cannot change their minds.  Just a thought
Deagol77 03/Dec/2006 at 08:30 PM
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So, we have to make elf kingdoms, dwarf kingdoms, Sauron’s eastern fortress, and men’s kingdoms? This gets harder everyday. I have to start over now.
Jesus Freak 04/Dec/2006 at 10:46 AM
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Well we can skip stuff, but it wouldn’t be accurate. So nobody minds if I include Cuivienen (or its remains) in some way, right?
Skauril 04/Dec/2006 at 12:17 PM
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By all means, use as little or as much artistic discretion as you wish.

Of course, you can always write ’Cuivienen - the lost realm where the elves awoke’  or something along those lines (if you’re making a big enough map, with room for plenty of text and details); that is, if you wish to really be specific. Or just plain Cuivienen, assuming the place still exists in some form. Perhaps it does... who is to say? There could well be some remnant left of the elves’ original home where some of the Avari still dwell, even if the landmasses did change dramatically.

Deagol77 04/Dec/2006 at 05:01 PM
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I think I’ll contact the admins about judging soon. Any of you guys talk to them already? I don’t want us to sound naggy.

Skauril, how dare you get to a higher level than me when you just learned how to join a kingdom! Just joking. Congratulations.

Deagol77 04/Dec/2006 at 05:07 PM
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Isn’t it wierd how only a few people post on this forum? It would be helpful for other people to share their thoughts or tell us that they want to enter. A bit more diversity would help out on my map! Hearing what every body knew about the east would be awesome, but impossible.

Jesus Freak 05/Dec/2006 at 06:22 AM
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Yeah, Skauril! I told you how and this is how you thank me?!? Getting ahead of me? (congratulations! )
Skauril 06/Dec/2006 at 01:18 AM
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Muahahaha! You are now in my shadow, Deagol and Jesus Freak... and my shadow is ever growing. It will soon engulf the world!   

... I am now a genuine bona fide easterling. Took me 320 points to get there!

I suggest you visit the halls of knowledge for more easy points! At least the first questions were easy enough.

But yeah, it would be nice to see more participants and more feedback in this map contest. I suspect the reason for the silence may be the fact that many people might view the act of mapping the unknown areas of Middle-earth as an infringment on Tolkien’s territory, so to speak. Overstepping their bounds, and so on. But the way I see it, it’s just a bit of creative fun, especially when nobody’s planning on publishing the maps on their own website and claiming that they have the approval of the Tolkien Estate, or something similar.  It’s not like any harm is being done here.

To my knowledge, no one has contacted the admins yet, so go ahead and do that, Deagol.

 

Lanthir Lamath 06/Dec/2006 at 02:07 AM
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*ambles in* Admin judging_ oh why not. However, while myself am not without cartographic skill (being a geographer), my applications thereof to ME are approximate at best_ I could judge your maps as maps, but not as ME maps. In my opinion, , the most qualified to judge your maps would be Istarendil, aka Feanor, the Librarian; he is, himself, a talented mapmaker who’s made a bunch of maps for the library. He can be found in The Library Forum, where I believe there is a thread about maps; you could ask him to upload the best map to the library if you want.
Skauril 06/Dec/2006 at 12:43 PM
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Thanks for the input, Lanthir.  No special credentials are needed. The fact that you have been an administrator here for a long time qualifies you to be a judge IMO. Of course, it wouldn’t hurt to have more than one opinion, including that of Istarendil.

Jesus Freak and Deagol, things just got a bit more complicated.  I’ve discovered information that points towards the possibility that the Yellow Mountains may have been destroyed during the shaping of the world at the end of the First Age. There was also another mountain chain, the Mountains of Wind, which was apparently situated between the Yellow Mountains and the Orocarni. It appears that the Mountains of Wind were flattened into hills, and there is a distinct possiblity that the Yellow Mountains were wiped out completely.

Use your own best judgement.. i.e. whether you wish to include said mountains in your map or not.

I cannot verify this to be 100% true, though (that the mountains were gone). It’s just something I read recently (it could have been someone’s personal misinterpretation of Tolkien’s texts, though).  We can only take solace in knowing that the Orocarni at least survived the turmoil of the reshaping of the world. I’ve seen enough credible sources that confirm this.

Maybe this is why everyone is hesitant at drawing maps of the East and South. There are too many questions left unanswered, and that creates a deadlock situation. There are plenty of details out there, but between Tolkien’s vague notes and the constant reshaping of the world throughout the ages,  you end up with lots of uncertainties.

Deagol77 06/Dec/2006 at 03:58 PM
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Thanks! I was getting close to finishing my third version of the map! I will have to make a new one now! This is getting pretty annoying, having to restart it all the time! Ah, well if it’s for artistic accuracy, I will get rid of the Yellow Mountains and the Wind Hills. I think I will put Sauron’s fortress there. It sounds like it could be a quite evil place.
Jesus Freak 07/Dec/2006 at 01:01 PM
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Oh no!  Not another change! I was almost done!  This is driving me crazy!  Oh well. I see your point, Skauril, about the lack of details making people hesitant. But I don’t see why that should stop people from trying. We should just say that they’re inaccurate.

I’m going to make the mountain chain that was the Yellow Mountains a chain of hills, and call it the Wind Hills. I’m keeping Sauron’s fortress where it is, though. Is there a specific location for it?  Thanks, Lanthir!

(And by the way, Skauril, where did you hear about the Wind Hills?)

Skauril 07/Dec/2006 at 01:47 PM
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Jesus Freak, apparently the Mountains of Wind (or the Wind Hills, if they were flattened in the reshaping or Arda) were a part of the Valar’s grand symmetric plan. The world was, before the corruption of Melkor, a place of everlasting light and divine symmetry, with two mountain chains on both ends (I previously assumed the northern chain in the west was the Misty Mountains, but it was in fact the Ered Luin - the Blue Mountains). And it seems there was a smaller mountain chain in between the respective ranges - the Mountains of Wind in the east, and some other range in the west (perhaps the White Mountains, or the Misty Mountains.. or whatever form they were in at that time?).

Alas, I have lost my source on the web (regarding the disappearance of the Yellow Mountains). However, the person who posted it seemed credible enough, and he had a page number from the Silmarillion for reference. I couldn’t check to see it it was true since I don’t have that book, though.

The same person mentioned the Mountains of Wind, and when I read that, I had a flashback. I distinctly remember hearing of their existence before (it’s possible they were mentioned in The Atlas). It was just one of those details that had slipped my mind.

As far as Sauron’s abode in the East is concerned.. its exact location is not known. So just use your imagination. Place it smack in the middle of Rhun, or somewhere in the southwest, or perhaps close to the Orocarni. Wherever you think would be the most logical place for it.

Jesus Freak 15/Dec/2006 at 03:15 PM
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Oh yeah, we can use any medium for the maps, right?
Deagol77 15/Dec/2006 at 03:36 PM
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I don’t see why not. As long as it won’t smudge and become illedgible in the scanner. I wouldn’t recommend pencil or charcoal. I tried to use that for my eighth version of my map and when I scanned it, it was so smudged I couldn’t use it and had to start over again. I am going to use a medieval style quill pen to give it that aged, swooping look that Tolkien’s maps seem to have.
Deagol77 15/Dec/2006 at 03:46 PM
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Skauril, are you going to change from an Easterling? Then you would be an orc or something and your name wouldn’t make any sense anymore. It is better to advance, but the Easterlings are your favorite. What are you going to do about that?

Is any one going to talk to Feanor about the maps? If you guys don’t, I will. We should get it out of the way soon.

Jesus Freak 15/Dec/2006 at 03:59 PM
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Why don’t we all ask? On the same thread, of course. It might draw his attention better. Just a thought...

Oin 15/Dec/2006 at 05:23 PM
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Deagol: Please keep your posts lore-related. The kingdom choice of Skauril is not part of the discussion, so please refrain from focusing your posts about it. Thanks!

If you guys want to ask Feanor (by which I assume you mean Ista, the Librarian), please do it in the Library forum. This forum is only for lore discussion. Thanks.

Tuna 18/Dec/2006 at 10:26 PM
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Skauril- I will admit that I am far from most of my books and thus have no way to conduct research, but I don’t ever recall hearing of these Mountains of the Wind or of the Yellow Mountains (unless by the latter you mean the Mountains of the Sun towards which I have only ever found 5 quotes in all of the "basic" Tolkien library plus all of the HOME volumes). Could you please provide some evidence or at least places to look so I can see for myself (when I return to college).

Skauril 19/Dec/2006 at 12:51 AM
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If I’m not completely mistaken, they were mentioned in the Atlas of Middle Earth (I had the book, but a friend of mine borrowed it a long time ago, and managed to lose it somewhere). I can’t for the life of me remember my other sources, but I have read of them in several different places.

The Mountains of the Sun (with the highest mountain peak in all of ME, Kalorme) that you are referring to were on a crescent shaped continent east of the main landmass of Middle-earth, and I believe they were removed from the world in the same manner as Valinor was when the world was made round. The Yellow Mountains and the Mountains of the Wind, however, seem to have been a part of the Valar’s grand symmetric plan, just as the Ered Luin and the Grey Mountains of the southeast were (and the Orocarni, too).

Here’s a quote from Wikipedia (I know some may not consider it a valid source, but they are very quick to remove fallacious information, after all):

During the creation of Arda, the Blue Mountains were meant to line up directly with the Grey Mountains of the southlands, forming the western wall of Middle-earth, just like the Red Mountains (or Orocarni) and Yellow Mountains formed the eastern wall. The range of the Blue Mountains was originally connected with the Red Mountains by the Ered Engrin or Iron Mountains. But this symmetry of Arda was broken during the wars before the Years of the Lamps.

The Yellow Mountains and the Mountains of Wind, I believe, were something that Tolkien mentioned only in passing in his early letters and maps. They obviously weren’t meant to have much significance beyond their role in maintaining the symmetry of the Valar’s divine plan (which was broken by Melkor).

I don’t have my books with me at the moment, either, so I can’t check them for further reference.

This is just something I’ve read (from several different sources along the years). You can take my word for it (though I’m currently searching for more information and better sources) or not. It’s up to you.

It’s not always easy to find info on these topics. Many details covered here may not be found in any of the books, i.e. the Silmarillion, the LotR trilogy, but rather perhaps in bits and pieces of information derived from Tolkien’s letters, maps and notes, some of which never made it into printed form in the main body of his works (including the Silmarillion).

For example, try and do a google search for "middle earth mountains of the sun" and see how many topics you can find. I couldn’t manage a single one, and yet it is conclusively proven that they did exist in Middle-earth for a time.

Kaos the Gold 19/Dec/2006 at 03:34 AM
Blacksmith of Erebor Points: 1279 Posts: 833 Joined: 21/Jun/2006
Here’s a point: the Valar didn’t create the misty mountains.  Morgoth created them to try and stop The Valar from reaching the elves at Cinuvien and vice versa.  That might help a bit.
Skauril 19/Dec/2006 at 03:50 AM
Scavenger of Mordor Points: 467 Posts: 163 Joined: 13/Dec/2004

Yes, that is true. They were never a part of the plan of symmetry. I erroneously speculated that they might have been the corresponding mountain range in the West to their counterpart in the East, but it was in fact the Ered Luin, not the Misty Mountains).

But what exactly was the point you were trying to make?

 

Tuna 19/Dec/2006 at 10:28 AM
Assassin of Mordor Points: 5570 Posts: 6645 Joined: 11/Mar/2004
Ah, I wasn’t even thinking of the Time of the Lamps. Will check it out when I get back home.
Jesus Freak 01/Jan/2007 at 06:38 AM
Apprentice of Minas Tirith Points: 188 Posts: 49 Joined: 16/Nov/2006

Ok guys, today’s the last day to post the maps! I’m having trouble posting it! Can someone tell me how?

Deagol77 01/Jan/2007 at 02:26 PM
Banned Points: 338 Posts: 64 Joined: 31/Oct/2006
Urgh! Mine isn’t done yet! Even if it was, my scanner is broken! If either one of you guys needs extra time, I’m cool with that. But only if someone else needs extra time. I don’t want to get special treatment.
Jesus Freak 01/Jan/2007 at 02:46 PM
Apprentice of Minas Tirith Points: 188 Posts: 49 Joined: 16/Nov/2006

I’m good with it! Skauril? How about it? Another few days? A week?

How much time were you thinking, Deagol77?

Skauril 01/Jan/2007 at 03:11 PM
Scavenger of Mordor Points: 467 Posts: 163 Joined: 13/Dec/2004

I must confess that I screwed up.  

That friend of mine that borrowed my copy of ’The Atlas’ had lost it somewhere (though he claims he gave it back), and I was therefore left with nothing but my own imagination and Tolkien’s vague notes as a foundation for my map. I started to churn out several pencil and paper sketches, and ended up with a couple of decent looking ones, but they weren’t up to the ridiculously high standards I set for myself, so I could never bring myself to finalize them. To make things worse, my other friend had sold his scanner, and I thus had no place to scan the unfinished maps.

I’m sorry guys. I tried, but too many obstacles kept coming up.

I hope you at least got your maps done with no hassle.

I recently started working on another project. I’m in the process of creating a fantasy world from scratch, hoping I don’t end up monkeying Tolkien too much (though I can’t deny his influence.. in my fantasy world, the East is a threat that’s always looming on the horizon). So far I’ve only used Microsoft Wordpad to write down my notes and passages on some of the history, races and deities of Aenor, but I’ll probably map a detailed map of it some day when I buy a scanner of my own, and perhaps write a short story or two that take place in the world (as opposed to Tolkien style notes and bits & pieces of scattered information). Anyway, it may be a bit of an overambitious project, and I’m hoping my vocabulary doesn’t start to run out at some point, but I do have a decent enough imagination, and I end up writing stuff down very fast once I get into that creative groove.

Take all the time you need with your maps. Do you think it would be best to wait until you both are done, or would it be ok to post them seperately?

Oin 01/Jan/2007 at 08:22 PM
Architect of Erebor Points: 11372 Posts: 8807 Joined: 14/Feb/2004
Skauril: While I applaud and encourage your efforts to try and draw some accurate maps of Tolkien’s East and post them here, which is perfectly fine, I must ask you not to post the original maps from your own world that you made, as this forum is for Tolkien’s work. Feel free to send them via other means to other members, but please do not post them on this forum. Thanks!
Skauril 02/Jan/2007 at 02:07 AM
Scavenger of Mordor Points: 467 Posts: 163 Joined: 13/Dec/2004

Yep, gotcha.

But what about the ’out of Middle-earth’ sub forum? Would it be ok to post something there, or is there a set rule that forbids the discussion of other fantasy worlds anywhere on the boards?

Oin 02/Jan/2007 at 03:08 AM
Architect of Erebor Points: 11372 Posts: 8807 Joined: 14/Feb/2004
Skauril: Out of Middle-Earth is fine. There’s no rule against discussing or presenting maps of other fantasy worlds. That only goes in the lore forums. You can post a link to the OOME thread here if you’d like once you create it if that would make it easier for you. 
Skauril 02/Jan/2007 at 08:06 AM
Scavenger of Mordor Points: 467 Posts: 163 Joined: 13/Dec/2004

Ok, thanks! I’ll do that once I make the map, and manage to write a sufficient amount of history to detail the the world it depicts.